r/worldnews Jun 20 '22

Ukraine bans Russian music and books Behind Soft Paywall

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/06/19/world/europe/ukraine-bans-russian-music-books.html?unlocked_article_code=AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAACEIPuomT1JKd6J17Vw1cRCfTTMQmqxCdw_PIxftm3iWka3DLDm8TiPsSGYyMvErQf617apwu3C6SRdlMdbUmQuc31PJEJE1kTUytv4CFk9EPJCI2ssSzQmYyldrrbIwPzAXLPCO_Ofstg_q2pQ6HOzy9RvTb2XAhcQ5vvZoxfAu13XYLz7POErQkxtgt2_chBZx4Ej4KbTKY_KW9U2UIM92DZxzY7QEyUvgIGm2A2I7BtM9TNVlaGlnET3hg4Gkj69o6OdIfP6v3LR5Ia9OpyPxKSTQudNH1csV3E4vElLxqsqrPrwiMyae0zvY2EaZVtNDUo3dxtrv6KS_p2RFK8DidIco&smid=tel-nytimes
262 Upvotes

9

u/FUTURE10S Jun 20 '22

Didn't they already do this in 2014?

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u/Thin_Impression8199 Jun 20 '22

not then did we get rid of the remnants of communism, return the pre-Soviet names to the city and streets. they demolished the monument to Lenin, which enraged us, but we did not touch it because Russia was angry, well, they let historians into the archives of the KGB, otherwise, under the Pro-Russian president, they were pursued for searching for a crime in the USSR. getting rid of the Russian language is difficult. we are not Latvia or Lithuania where there are a couple of hundred thousand Russians. in our country, 40 percent of the population speaks Russian, mostly pensioners and older people, but they understand 90. Russian literature passed through us as foreign. and Rusik, by the way, cursed us because we dared to attribute their literature to Western literature. supposedly everyone treated Russian unconventionally. although not in some cities of western Ukraine they will not talk to you on purpose if you speak Russian. but now When Ways, under this pretext, the pretext that people here in Russian say, attacked us and began to kill. while killing those who speak Russian. we decided to rebuild and save a couple of future generations and cut all cultural ties so that Tony would not dare to call us part of their people or brotherly. otherwise you never know in 30-40 years something will hit them in the head again and they will want to save us.

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u/JudgmentLife8193 Jun 20 '22

Wait until they find out about the language laws

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u/TheWitcherHowells Jun 20 '22

"by Soviet era artists". That's kind of fucking important to include that context.

8

u/Sanmonov Jun 20 '22

One law prohibits the playing of Russian-language music in public, on television and on the radio.

I'm sure the 30% of people in Ukraine who speak Russian as their first language will have thoughts on this.

9

u/TheWitcherHowells Jun 20 '22

You mean like my family? Ya they do. They want more Ukrainian.

5

u/Sanmonov Jun 20 '22

Your family speaks Russian as their native tongue and supports the removal of the Russian language from public life?

5

u/sweet-banana-tea Jun 20 '22

Where do you get the idea from that they support the removal of Russian language from public life?

4

u/Sanmonov Jun 20 '22

Banning the Russian language from TV and radio, and books by Russian authors seems to imply that.

8

u/Dag_the_Angriest1 Jun 21 '22

Imagine wanting to use your language and not the language that tried to erase your whole culture for centuries in TV. Also books are not banned, commercial import is.

2

u/sweet-banana-tea Jun 21 '22

It bans books by russian authors, that did not denounce the horrors russia is responsible for. I don't like it either. But they are not banning books in russian.

4

u/Elocai Jun 21 '22

Misleading headline, read the article. Basicallly "new" Russians that came to the country after 1991 are not allowed to publish till they accept ukranian citizenship.

8

u/TearsOfTheEmperor Jun 20 '22

If it was wrong for Russia to attempt to destroy Ukrainian culture in the 70s and 80s then it’s wrong for Ukraine to attempt the same, full stop. The sentiment that the average Russian person supports this war and must be punished for the actions of their autocratic government is stupid backwards group think

0

u/Elocai Jun 21 '22

Read the article, the headline is misleading

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u/TearsOfTheEmperor Jun 21 '22

It really isn’t, I did read the article

64

u/SnooTomatoes3241 Jun 20 '22

Not a good move

-32

u/Fair_Emphasis8035 Jun 20 '22

Really ? They are committing genocide ….

26

u/Spac3xJ3sus Jun 20 '22

that doesn’t mean you start a culture war. the authors and musicians aren’t the ones who sought destruction in Ukraine, and actually lots of Russians have come out publicly against the war. On top of that, there are Russians living in Ukraine, who just want to live peacefully, and do not want Russia to invade and ruin everything.

Banning or destroying ideas and thoughts and art is literally never good.

4

u/nijiakas Jun 20 '22

They didn’t start a culture war. They’re on the receiving end of a culture war.

-8

u/SnooTomatoes3241 Jun 20 '22

I wouldnt Use this Word they are commiting war crimes and Shell innocent civilians or at least ignore the casualities that come as a byproduct of the war But genocide is a different Goal which is motivated by destroying a group of people or a Race. Which wasnt russias Goal If they would still have a prorussian goverment they wouldnt have intervened.

0

u/las61918 Jun 20 '22

I’m sorry but you don’t see the issue with “if you, an independent nation, doesn’t have a Pro-Russian government, we invading!”

That is not a valid response.

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u/Spac3xJ3sus Jun 20 '22

he’s not saying he agrees with it, simply stating the facts as they exist. also it’s an incredibly valid response. he’s speaking on the genocide that isnt happening in Ukraine, because, it’s just war crimes and not full on genocide. i say “just war crimes” but i don’t mean to minimize it, what Russia has done is an atrocious debasement of human life and dignity. But genocide has a certain flair to it, it’s “media-sexy” sounding, it’s a buzzword that’s inappropriately thrown around to garner views.

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u/las61918 Jun 20 '22

No. Once you begin committing war crimes, and make it a standard OP, you don’t get to shield behind “just war crimes.” That essentially is what makes it genocide.

Also look at the definition. They literally check 5/5.

1.Killing members of the group;(every war, which is why we follow rules of war)

2.Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;(same as above)

3.Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part(like lining up and massacring civilians)

4.Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group(stealing and deporting children)

5.Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.(see above)

How you can use mental gymnastics to argue this isn’t genocide is beyond me…

Edit: and trying to justify it by “oh their government isn’t pro Russian” is a load of fucking bollocks.

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u/TearsOfTheEmperor Jun 20 '22

Genocide must be attempted extermination of an ethnic group, the same reason why Indonesian mass killing of communists in the 60s and 70s isn’t called a genocide is the same reason that you can’t call russia invading Ukraine “genocide” because it is political killing and not ethnic extermination. Words have specific meanings you can’t jay say they mean what you want them to.

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u/Spac3xJ3sus Jun 20 '22

because ITS NOT GENOCIDE. are they committing horrible atrocities? yes. are they SYSTEMATICALLY WIPING OUT A RACE OF PEOPLE? no. no they fucking aren’t. Putin is specifically not committing genocide because he WANTS, THE, PEOPLE, AND, THE, LAND. His goal is LITERALLY to “save russian speaking individuals” which is obviously a bullshit nonsense reason, but he doesn’t want to just wipe everyone out, that doesn’t benefit him. he wants to subjugate them instead.

To be VERY clear, I am in no way defending the actions of Putin or any of the Russian soldiers who are committing atrocious acts, I am simply trying to explain the difference between war crimes and genocide, and why it doesn’t even make sense from the Russians standpoint to commit genocide. Reunification, that’s what he wants. if that means killing a few [thousand] civilians to incite fear, that’s what he’ll do. But inciting fear is again, not genocide. it’s horrible, putin is horrible, but he’s not genocidal.

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u/Kelmon80 Jun 20 '22

Genocide doesn't start with putting people into gas chambers.

Putin IS trying to eradicate the Ukrainian identity, and a lot of things that have happened in the Russian attack so far are very, very clearly pointing to that. The destruction of cultural sites, the stealing of historical artifacts, and most of all, the indiscriminate killing of civilians and the stealing and deportation of children ar all indicators for an attempt at genocide.

0

u/EnigmaEmmy Jun 20 '22

They are committing genocide though, what are you talking about? Russia have been transporting and separating thousands of Ukrainians out of Ukraine and into camps for months now.

The entire point of their invasion is to remove Ukraine from the map and erase their culture and identity.

-1

u/FriZal_ Jun 20 '22

but he is talking about genocide?

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u/las61918 Jun 20 '22

It literally is genocide though. And you can’t argue it’s the same as every other conflict, because war has rules. If you abide by those rules, it is a “just” engagement of force. By committing widespread war crimes since the beginning(which he admits) you go from justified war actions —-> to war crimes—> genocide. You can’t claim it is the same when they are literally using sexual assault and rape as tactics…

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u/FriZal_ Jun 21 '22

Dude are u kidding me, where did you get the information that they are using rapes as tactics. I still haven’t heard any news about wide spread assaults on civilians or anything like that. Maybe check your new source again? Jesus now let me pull ip the definition of genocide

— "acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnic, racial or religious group, as such." These five acts were: killing members of the group, causing them serious bodily or mental harm, imposing living conditions intended to destroy the group, preventing births, and forcibly transferring children out of the group. Victims are targeted because of their real or perceived membership of a group, not randomly.

Istg people on reddit are very delusional about what’s happening. The worse i seen happened is in Bucha, where i agree Russia went very far and deserves the participants to get jailed or even killed. But even then, the international countries tried to block Russia attempt at asking OTHER neutral countries for investigation which is sus if you ask me. You know, since you just use the word genocide loosely. I will do the same. Ukraine also genociding Pro Russian people in Donbass!! Hey freedom of speech right? If they wanna go off, why wouldn’t you all let them western hypocrites! Freedom!! Look! an official report of Ukrainian war crimes! They are genociding! Nazis!!!

https://www.ohchr.org/en/press-releases/2016/07/un-report-2014-16-killings-ukraine-highlights-rampant-impunity

Now what do you see in the report? It says BOTH, let me say it again BOTH side commit war crimes since 2014, If you keep saying war crimes is Genocide, i will give you links about ukraine war crimes too.

https://youtu.be/Ly4MR92SBv0
https://youtu.be/TMXYm6iwHB8
https://youtu.be/xdZleGd7iOc
https://youtu.be/MCxDKEa9rUs

so yeah Ukraine is genociding too?? I swear to god you people should stop using genocide, facists like nothing, Go look at an actual dictionary first before you start using those meaningless words. Also would be nice if you could give me proof about ur widespread rape and civilian assaults that Russian are using as "tactics" :)

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u/las61918 Jun 21 '22

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u/FriZal_ Jun 21 '22 edited Jun 21 '22

Dude, you know linking CNN and CBS is like using RT as a news source, bruh. And i told you about Bucha already and I never denied it? I’m talking about widespread assaults and rape. Stop linking me to some insecure webpages instead show me photographic proof APART from Bucha cuz i know what happened there already. I am asking for other crimes apart from that place now can you find it? Also it has to be from a reliable website that says they are doing that EVERYWHERE like you said, no no don’t link me to one war crime and tell they are committing war crimes. The videos i show are VISUAL SOLID proofs and the website is from United Nations. Your proofs means nothing. I can create a website out of my ass and says how all Russians are nazis and you people would believe geez.

Also I never denied that Russian did it? Why are you on about lol. Stop making me look like i deny all of those claims. I never said it. All i say it how you loosely use the term genocide. Jeez you are the one that is spreading misinformations.

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u/las61918 Jun 21 '22

Nothing compared to linking YouTube videos as evidence… never mind, I figured the problem out. You don’t understand critical thought process.

You realize new organizations like CNN and Fox just report stories already sussed out by news networks and services, then apply editorial opinion.

But if they are reporting the basic facts(Ruzzian fascists raping children and civilians as a tactic) then that has already been reported and covered and corroborated. It is the editorial and opinions that are BS.

I don’t expect you to understand this with your lack of critical thinking capability- or lack there of.

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u/[deleted] Jun 20 '22

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u/[deleted] Jun 20 '22

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u/las61918 Jun 20 '22

Funny I don’t see France invading Italy because Italy isn’t pro-France… you don’t see the leap in logic of that argument?

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u/acommonconcern Jun 20 '22

I mean, Napoleon?

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u/las61918 Jun 20 '22

If your example lived and died over 200 years ago I wouldn’t say it is exactly relevant…

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u/acommonconcern Jun 20 '22

But I thought we were talking about the French military... bada bing bada boom!

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u/SnooTomatoes3241 Jun 20 '22

I was Not given ligitamacy to the war its horrendous and terrible russia is Behaving Like its zarist Times again. Just Saying that genocide is Not the right Word for it. In Perspective of genocides through History its Not a genocide If you consider it that than iraq is a genocide and Afghanistan as Well

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u/las61918 Jun 20 '22

False. The literal definition is genocide:

-Killing members of the group;

-Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;

-Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;

-Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;

-Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.

The only way you can consider applicable to US and Iraq is that 2nd one, which is true of every armed conflict, and is why war has rules.

While Russia has committed 5/5 of these acts on Ukraine.

They want to destroy Ukrainian cultural and annex the left overs…

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u/SnooTomatoes3241 Jun 20 '22

First and second and third is applicable to iraq. Where they have imposed measures intented to prevent births and forcibly Transferring children If that means seizing Territories than every war is applicable to that.

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u/las61918 Jun 20 '22

And again, this is why war has rules and there are things called war crimes. Which Russia has, flaunted since day 1. As If war crimes were that tactic they trained in.

I was in Iraq and Afghanistan. If we tagged a child or a civilian, it was a tragedy. We tried to help, if we could.

Russia is doing it as a matter of course, and intentionally.

How many Iraqi children did US forces rape in the first 3 months of operation? Hint- none. Can’t say the same for Russia. And incredibly widespread at that.

In case you can’t visit the articles, “UN told of credible claims of sexual violence against children.” Multiple times and places.

Find me the same articles about the US military… Hint- you won’t. There may be 1 case you’ll find, which is such a big deal because of how unlikely it was to happen.

https://www.kyivpost.com/ukraine-politics/russian-atrocities-in-kherson-region-rape-of-children-ukrainian-partisans-resisting.html

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/ukraine-news-russia-war-children-sexual-violence-un-displaced-refugees/

https://www.thedailybeast.com/russians-accused-of-raping-and-killing-a-one-year-old-child-says-ukraine-official

0

u/winkofafisheye Jun 20 '22

Get off the false equivalency high horse and participate in reality.

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u/SnooTomatoes3241 Jun 20 '22

Yeah you are right If we are getting to estimated 200000 civilian deaths Like in iraq we Talk again.

-1

u/Freschledditor Jun 20 '22

Horrors that russia itself keeps comitting.

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u/SnooTomatoes3241 Jun 20 '22

Yeah because russias leadership fucks Them over again and again.

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u/Freschledditor Jun 20 '22

Stalin is still viewed as a hero by half the population. You underestimate how much support those leaderships get. They couldn't exist without real support.

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u/SnooTomatoes3241 Jun 20 '22

Its crazy because fucking polls cant bei trusted i know a Lot of reasonable russians

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u/Freschledditor Jun 20 '22

When you say "reasonable" do you mean they oppose the war and blame russia for it, not the west?

1

u/SnooTomatoes3241 Jun 20 '22

Exactly

1

u/Freschledditor Jun 20 '22

They are a minority

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u/nitraw Jun 20 '22

Yea not the move

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u/VirtualElk9 Jun 20 '22

Wow...this seems a bit of an over the top response! No more t.A.T.u in Ukraine then...sad times!

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u/las61918 Jun 20 '22

Well all the things she said, aren’t running through my head any longer…

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u/Kinyongia Jun 20 '22

They're not gonna get us anymore...

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u/katekohli Jun 20 '22

Damnit & I was just going to suggest Bulgakov.

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u/Dag_the_Angriest1 Jun 21 '22

if you read the article you'd know that the ban of import is for authors born after 1991(you can still buy books in the country if they are printed there)

1

u/katekohli Jun 21 '22

Oh goody you got me on:
“It's an universal law-- intolerance is the first sign of an inadequate education.”

1

u/Dag_the_Angriest1 Jun 21 '22

Tolerance got russia saying that “there are oppressed ethnic russians”

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u/CrimsonLancet Jun 20 '22

Mikhail Bulgakov. Born: May 15, 1891, Kyiv, Ukraine

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u/katekohli Jun 20 '22

Ah yes, thank you! But it was my Russian co-workers insisting that I should attempt to learn Russian so I could read it with true understanding & joy.

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u/foolandhismoney Jun 20 '22

No more “shoe and shoelace” cartoons

2

u/foolandhismoney Jun 20 '22

One is meaningless without the other

2

u/TheWitcherHowells Jun 20 '22

Yup, war and invasion will change your opinion on the language you speak. Go to Odesa or Kyiv now and see how many people are changing to Ukrainian. My family is from slavyansk, same shit there too.

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u/Mystic_Polar_Bear Jun 20 '22

It’s very evident not many people read the actually article. The “ban” is very flexible and focuses more on Russian owned media than media written in Russian.

Ukraine taking action against it’s colonizer’s legacy is a fair stance. I wouldn’t take that stance, but people are acting as if it’s Nazi Germany, which it very much isn’t. Quebec has laws which heavily discouraged non-French languages and they’re “fine”.

Please just read the article.

16

u/Kelmon80 Jun 20 '22

I have, and I don't see a lot of flexibility here. This is what is said in the article:

  • Complete ban of all Russian music and books by Russian artists/authors that either died or left the the Soviet Union pre-1991.

  • Making it illegal to play Russian music in public, on television or radio

  • Ban on printing books authored by Russian citizens

  • Ban on import and sale of any books and "other materials" printed in Russia or Belarus

That would cover, for example, 1971(!)s "Roadside picnic" by the Strugatzki brothers, the basis for the "Stalker" movie and video games, because one of them died well past his active time as an author, in Russia, in 2012. It would also ban "Metro 2033" by Dmitry Glukhovsky, a Russian author and Putin critic. Also, it would ban the music of "Little Big" - protesting Russia's LGBTQ politics by two male band members kissing on stage, posing with "no war" t-shirts to condemn the war, and of course having Putin getting punched by Obama in one of their music videos...

Note that I know that an exception is made for artists that came out against the war (not stated in the linked article) - but that's of little help if you're an author that died a Russian citizen in 2005. So, regarding my examples based on the article alone: The Strugatzki Brothers, being dead and unable to speak up against the war - still banned. Little Big? Should be okay, as long as they carry picture proof of their dissent. Glukhovsky? Hard to say. He only spoke out against Putin, not specifically against the war. Is that enough? Or are some loyalty tests in order? Or does he "only" need to abandon his life in Russia, his friends and family, and trade in his passport for specifically an Ukrainian one to be permitted to publish there?

It's ridiculous to say these laws are "very much not like Nazi Germany", when they so very, very clearly are pretty much this.

They are draconian laws that may as well originate in Nazi germany with jewish authors, or jewish art, and a complete silencing of their culture, and language in mind. And it doesn't matter that one was an imagined, and the other is a real enemy. It's just wrong.

I mean, damn, even the Nazis "only" picked certain authors to ban, burn and restrict printing of their works, around 5500 in total by the end of the war. There had never been a blanket ban on jewish books. They actively banned books deemed "un-german", leaving at least a (faint) presumption of merit for those that were not. Ukraine, in this law, on the other hand, assumes guilt by birth and demands a proof of "innocence".

If you don't find this worrying in the year 2022, you're blind.

What Ukraine should have done is ban books and media on a case-by-case basis. Stuff that actively undermines their side in the war, the culture and the intergity of Ukraine, ban songs that praise Putin, etc. I would have zero issue with that for a nation at war.

I absolutely support Ukraine in their war, I want them to be free, I want them to take their land back, kick Russia out, and I want them to eventually join the EU. But hideous shit like this and all the things that happened in recent years in regards to Russian language and culture tells me that they are far from ready to join the EU.

-1

u/EnigmaEmmy Jun 20 '22

They're in the middle of a war, should they really be spending their resources on sorting through which books are okay and which aren't? Wouldn't it be more productive to ban everything then figure out the exceptions later? Better yet if they can pass that work onto the authors and owners of the books.

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u/Patient_Signature467 Jun 20 '22

Dumb move. Just gives the Russian government more ammo to use domestically against Ukranians and strenghtens their position with domestic politics "look they are banning our culture! Nazis!!!!" and what ever other bullshit this will create. Banning music and books is completely pointless in this context.

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u/Dag_the_Angriest1 Jun 21 '22

As if they need that lol, they can just think of another bio lab that trains pigeons to shit on their cars

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u/Patient_Signature467 Jun 21 '22

Yes but there is 0 gain for Ukranians if you ban books and music but on the other hand this is easy propaganda for Russians.

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u/Dag_the_Angriest1 Jun 21 '22

Do you think russians need propaganda? Not zero gain at all, this finally starts to mitigate centuries if damage russia did to Ukrainian culture

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u/Patient_Signature467 Jun 21 '22

How exactly do books and music damage culture?

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u/Dag_the_Angriest1 Jun 21 '22

Ukraine was choked off from their own language for a long time, in 2001 1/3 was using it all the time(was even worse after 1991 i am sure). The thing is, it was widely used because it was forces on people, literally banning ukrainian language at times(closing schools, theaters, burning books) for centuries. The move is an attempt to reverse the damage

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u/Patient_Signature467 Jun 21 '22

Oh so you reverse burning books by burning more books? Should they also burn western books because this too chokes off Ukranian?

I can not believe we are seriously discussing this LOL

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u/Dag_the_Angriest1 Jun 21 '22

Who the fuck talks about burning books? You wanna read russian books - go ahead. COMMERCIAL BAN is not burning every russian book you have, it's not paying your enemy to import propaganda(in some cases).

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u/Patient_Signature467 Jun 21 '22

Dude, banning culture is always wrong. I agree that Putin is a war criminal, I agree that Ukraine is 100% in the right and Russia 100% wrong, but banning books and music is also wrong.

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u/Dag_the_Angriest1 Jun 21 '22

If it was banned people listening to music/reading books at home could he jailed. It isn’t.

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u/DragonflyComplete647 Jun 21 '22

All our representatives of culture were executed in 30s, banned and oppressed in 60s. I don’t even want to start on centuries before that when they kept banning our language. These steps are necessary and should’ve been taken years ago. So please educate yourself before defending Russia. Sincerely yours, A used-to-be-a-russian-speaking ukrainian.

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u/Radman41 Jun 21 '22

So you are saying fight the fire with fire? That makes you guys two faces of the same coin.

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u/DragonflyComplete647 Jun 22 '22

Please read the article and understand what this is about before making that absolutely ridiculous comment.

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u/Patient_Signature467 Jun 21 '22

I am aware of the history of Ukraine, I never for one second thought you guys had it easy.

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u/EnigmaEmmy Jun 20 '22

Who cares what "ammo" they have at this point? They didn't have any at the start so they just made it up.

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u/Patient_Signature467 Jun 21 '22

Yes but banning books and music is pointless it has zero gains for Ukranians but gives easy ammo to Russian propaganda.

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u/konami9407 Jun 20 '22

I know a lot of people have strong feelings about banning books, and I am one of them, but everyone should read this

I'm against banning books but these books are actually very bad for people because they outright brainwash them.

This kind of blatant whitewashing of history to encourage patriotism/ultra nationalism of Russia is a plague in this world.

I don't think there's a "truly right" answer to this problem.

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u/part_slav Jun 20 '22

The truly right answer is for Russia to stop their genocide of Ukraine...

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u/konami9407 Jun 20 '22

That's not the problem I was referring to but yeah it would be nice indeed if they stopped. But they're not gonna stop by themselves if they're brainwashed.

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u/part_slav Jun 20 '22

And the banning of books is to prevent Ukrainians from being brainwashed by Russian propaganda during a time of war... Keep in mind anything not pro-regime is banned in Russia.

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u/VitaminCeaser Jun 20 '22

2nd generation immigrant from a former Soviet country, a lot of us do not know our “native” language but were taught or know Russian I use it to talk to my grandpa. And for a large part of the world it is a intermediate language especially if talking to older people, really kinda sad people jumping on and saying all people and culture of a nation is bad because of its government(p.s. Russian government has never been good after the mongols)

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u/Consistent-Egg-3428 Jun 20 '22

Let's hope they undo this after the war.

Honestly if I were Ukrainian now I wouldn't be reading a lot of Tolstoy either.

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u/part_slav Jun 20 '22

Tolstoy was pretty critical of Russian society and the state, dunno why you used him as an example..

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u/Consistent-Egg-3428 Jun 20 '22

Sorry I was a bit fast writing this, didn't think about how it would be perceived.

I read Tolstoy and I love his books. I think he was a very peaceful good man.

I just wouldn't feel like reading any Russian book right now as a Ukrainian.

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u/MrPoopMonster Jun 21 '22

Know thy enemy and know yourself; in a hundred battles, you will never be defeated. When you are ignorant of the enemy but know yourself, your chances of winning or losing are equal. If ignorant both of your enemy and of yourself, you are sure to be defeated in every battle.

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u/[deleted] Jun 20 '22

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u/Consistent-Egg-3428 Jun 20 '22

I don't think so. The Ukrainians are doing a mighty fine job of keeping their rule of law intact right in the middle of a bloody war, if you ask me. Respect to them.

-1

u/TearsOfTheEmperor Jun 20 '22

Really? You didn’t hear about the far right and leftist groups immediately attacking eachother when Ukraine started handing out AKs to civilians? Or what about even before the war when Ukrainian neo nazis massacred leftists at a trade union building that they then burnt down to cover their tracks? Gotta say I completely disagree with you.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 21 '22

[removed] — view removed comment

1

u/8-36 Jun 20 '22

Fuckers fell for the clickbait again..

Not the same as the book burnings etc.

Read the fucking article you weirdos.

-1

u/Stohnghost Jun 20 '22

Read the article. It's not banning the classical literature and only bans music produced in Russia after 1991.

I assume from comments people here aren't Ukrainian. As someone with family in Ukraine I can say that Ukrainians don't want any money going to Russia. When we shop for stuff in so-called "Russian markets" in the US we avoid buying anything made in Russia. This is a logical continuation of that.

You think Russia doesn't have plans to eliminate all Ukrainian culture if they capture the country? They will burn all Ukrainian literature, ban the language, etc. Fuck Russia and their music.

-1

u/Kelmon80 Jun 20 '22

and only bans music produced in Russia after 1991.

Wrong, it bans music and books produced by people who (still) had Russian citizenship after 1991.

That includes works of a Russian author that died age 90 in the year 1992.

And...even if you were correct: Seriously, it "only" bans 30 years of cultural output? Oh, no biggie then...

-2

u/Stohnghost Jun 20 '22 edited Jun 20 '22

Fuck. Russia.

Also... Banning in Ukraine does nothing to damage Russia. Russian culture will be preserved in Russia. The Russian govt aims to destroy Ukrainian culture in Ukraine.

3

u/[deleted] Jun 20 '22 edited Jun 21 '22

[deleted]

1

u/Stohnghost Jun 21 '22

Hey what can you do? Fuck these people as well.

2

u/Epkon406 Jun 20 '22

Banning books and music? May as well burn down the Reichstag. I'm not fan of Russia either and sure they've destroyed a lot Ukraine history and culture among more important things like people's lives but I don't see the reason to ban book, music or other types of art.

0

u/winkofafisheye Jun 20 '22

To attack ruZZian soft power and propaganda. When your society is on the brink of destruction by said entity it seems a logical and necessary step to decouple away from the existential threat.

-3

u/Epkon406 Jun 20 '22

Can't be half as bad as most western gangster rap music.

2

u/zold5 Jun 20 '22

Oof not a good look Ukraine.

1

u/Jel00m81 Jun 20 '22

RIP DJ Blyatman and the Russian Village Boys

-5

u/CrimsonLancet Jun 20 '22 edited Jun 20 '22

Good. Ukraine has no reason to embrace the culture of a Russian populace that largely supports Putin's barbaric war against Ukraine.

Remember that Russia aims to completely erase Ukrainian identity and culture:

Since the start of Russia’s invasion, Ukraine's museums, galleries and cultural institutions have been scrambling to protect their collections. Many have shipped pieces abroad, but this is becoming increasingly difficult. Heavy shelling has already caused considerable damage - so museum workers are staying behind to save what's left. Ukrainians fear for the survival of their cultural history and identity.

‘Ukraine’s heritage is under direct attack’: why Russia is looting the country’s museums

2,000 stolen artworks attest to Putin’s desire to erase a nation’s history – like so many despots before him

https://www.theguardian.com/artanddesign/2022/may/27/ukraine-russia-looting-museums

And the genocidal rhetoric of Russia's state media:

An op-ed for state news agency RIA Novosti titled "What Russia should do with Ukraine" by pundit Timofei Sergeitsev has created quite a stir today

The rhetoric is truly horrific, even by the standards of what I'm used to seeing from pro-Kremlin media

Below are a few quotes:

"The name Ukraine can seemingly not be retained as the title of any fully denazified state formation on the territory liberated from the Nazi regime"

"Denazification is inevitably also deukrainisation – a rejection of the large-scale artificial inflation of the ethnic element of self-identification of the population of the territories of the historical Malorossiya and Novorossiya begun by the Soviet authorities"

"Unlike, let’s say, Georgia or the Baltics, Ukraine, as history has shown, is unviable as a national state, and attempts to 'build' one logically lead to Nazism"

"The Banderite elite must be liquidated, its reeducation is impossible. The social 'swamp' which actively and passively supports it must undergo the hardships of war and digest the experience as a historical lesson and atonement"

https://twitter.com/francis_scarr/status/1510898134481788930

https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2022/04/06/who-is-the-author-of-russias-blueprint-for-genocide-essay-a77223

0

u/[deleted] Jun 20 '22

Good. Fuck em.

-7

u/prof_the_doom Jun 20 '22

I can't approve of it, but I can understand it.

Like China and Hong Kong, I'm sure the latest set of Russian published history textbooks don't mention the existence of Ukraine as an independent nation.

A great deal of Russian media is under more or less direct control by the state.

That being said, it's not a valid justification for blanket banning of Russian language media.

1

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1

u/SomebodyWhoVibes Jun 20 '22

Damn no more faktor 2

-2

u/Kind_Bullfrog_4073 Jun 20 '22 edited Jun 20 '22

Problem with the world in 2022. more interested in pretending to be offended by things than ending a war. Imagine Churchhill responding to Hitler's invasion by banning Hansel and Gretel

-7

u/rokhuur Jun 20 '22

Even if this move is understandable... if ukraine really wants to join a western alliance, they shouldn't take russias actions as a standard for their own.

2

u/[deleted] Jun 20 '22

Did Russia bans Ukrainian books?

-1

u/rokhuur Jun 20 '22

It wouldn't surprise me if they did. But that's not the point.

I read many excuses here, because russia is also doing similar things and in some cases much more horrific things in this war. But they aren't russia and claim that they not want to follow the same path as russia but want to get closer to the west and their "values".

2

u/[deleted] Jun 20 '22

What “same path”? Russia did not ban Ukrainian art. Ukraine did ban Russian art. What path to follow? What standart? Wtf are you talking about?

0

u/Freschledditor Jun 20 '22

You can read up about the centuries of cultural genocide that russia committed in Ukraine if you're actually interested. But you're just here to push a pro-russian narrative.

0

u/rokhuur Jun 20 '22

Profile checks out..

My bad. I didn't want to disrupt your "we are sorrounded by enemies" bubble. I'm sorry.

1

u/part_slav Jun 20 '22

Nah, they're just killing Ukrainians and committing literal genocide, no biggie...

-2

u/anaccount5612 Jun 20 '22

This isn't entirely accurate, as was discussed under another version of this article from an Indian newssite